tv Hardball With Chris Matthews MSNBC July 29, 2011 2:00pm-3:00pm PDT
with you. >> thank you. >> the movie is the "whistle-blower" check it out. i'm dylan ratigan. check out our latest, deepak choeb pa, save yourself to save the world. map is collective consciousness? dylanratigan.com. "hardball," up right now. the tea party gets its way for now. let's play some "hardball." good evening. i'm michael in for chris matthews. leading off tonight, if at first you don't succeed, add a balanced budget amendment. we may now have the clearest example of how dysfunctional washington has become. john boehner embarrassed when he didn't have enough votes to pass his bill. that bill was going to die in the senate for lack of democratic support. what happened today? boehner added a balanced budget
amendment, expected to win over enough tea party republicans but also a poison pill for democrats. so now what? the house vote is expected soon, and we'll get the latest as the clock ticks down to tuesday's deadline. plus, how far will tea party republicans go get what they want? is it really conservative to risk defaulted? we have a tea partier here tonight. plus, is anyone winning politically? president obama is trying to position himself as the adult in the room, but if the economy tanks, don't his prospects tank with it? and have you had enough? if people are fed up with democrats and republicans, is there a third way? a group called americans elect says, yes, and it may have the money and the know-how to get a third party ticket on the ballot in all 50 states. and finally, let me finish with the solution to the debt crisis that's right in front of congress' nose. we start with the debt ceiling crisis chuck todd is, of course, nbc's chief white house correspondent and political director. chuck a volatile situation all day long. where do we stand right now?
>> reporter: look, back-time it as far as the calendar is concerned. at some time boehner will pass his bill, looks he has his votes. that's what luke russert and kelly o'donnell's report say. when they send it to the senate, harry reid wants to file something called cloture by midnight, why? because he's trying to, at some point, get a bill passed, sent back to the house by monday, giving the house about 24 hours to pass an amended version of whatever bill the senate sends back to meet the august 2nd deadline. so that's the clock they're working with, and the calendar that they're working with. what does that mean? as soon as boehner files this bill there's going to be a serious amount of back room negotiations between reid and some republicans. there's some sort of quiet negotiations now with some moderate republicans, possibly people like tennessee senator bob corker, alaska senator lisa murkowski. some folks like that who
publicly said they're talking about working with reid on some form of a compromise. right now the senate republican leadership is not engaging in these talks. they want to wait to see what happens in the house until boehner comes over. and this is very important. mike, because the issue is, to get this clock moving, reid's got to file his bill by midnight tonight, and whatever's in it is the bill. they're not going to have time to be bog amendments and they're going to get it all dumbed up and lame for days, so in order to get this negotiatinged version of getting rid of a second trigger in debt ceiling, adding new triggers this and that, reid's got to get this negotiated version by midnight tonight. >> from the outside looking in. i guess i was wrong. i thought this was a case of speaker boehner passing something, anything, as much for his personal survival as the house speaker as for the good of the country. in other words, he couldn't personally afford to have the day end without getting
something passed. if i'm understanding what you're saying, it sounds like that which is beginning in the house really might get negotiated in the senate and ultimately end up on the president's desk? >> reporter: depends on what you define as the boehner bill. look, there's a legislative clock issue here and calendar issue. if harry reid uses just the boehner bill number and erases everything with boehner and replaces it with him, then that save as step and allows them to have this process i described and get this possibly to, back to the house for another vote before it hits the president's desk by monday. >> understood. but it may not even resemble that which came out of the house. >> reporter: kinecorrect. other than the actual number that john baoehner has. the only thing. if harry reid, he has to do it with his bill first, that adds
day of legislative calendar cha chaos. >> thank you for that report, chuck todd. joirn joining me now, simon hobbs. speak to me how markets are reacting? >> the market believe there's will be a default, that everybody would be that stupid to threat go that far, the nuvsness is palpable. look at the dow jones industrial average we've lost the best part of 600 points over the last six sessions. more than 4.5%. a huge amount of activity behind the scenes. technical activity to deal with the process of a default for 20 wall street bank, with the treasury today. yesterday a huge conference call about how you work through what would be a technical default. one thing i could leave you with it is this -- as the hours tick by it becomes increasingly likely the greatest nation in the world, the united states, will be stripped of its
aaa credit rating by the agency. it means the rest of the world will say you are more of a liability to lend money to than singapore or hong kong, france, germany britain or indeed canada. i believe when this historic episode is written, michael, they will lay the blame squarely on the part the republicans and personally on john boehner in particular. let me explain why. for ten years on international markets we've known about the deficit, the trade deficit, and knew it had to be sorted out and were looking for an approach on that and you've had various commissions in that regard. what the republicans decided to do was up the ante. accelerate things and have the fight now. and what in effect did they do? we'll use the debt ceiling, meaning they're saying to the rest of the world, you knee $14 trillion we've length to you and our own people? come tuesday we may not pay any interest on it and may not repay the principle. they hold the rest of the world
to ransom. what do they get in return for that? remember here from s&p, about $4 trillion of spending cuts or revenue increases to start bending the curve down. when obama was talking to boehner three weeks ago we getting towards that. now we don't have anywhere near $4 trillion move at all, because boehner couldn't sell the revenue increases to his own parties. we're not bending the curve down. we're holding the world -- one more thing, michael. in that process, the politics are poisoned, the bipartisan approach lost and more hurdles set up along the way such as the balanced budget amendment. aaa rated countries don't sign in by those rules, michael. >> i have the president speaking earlier today on that threat to the nation's aaa credit rating. let's all watch. >> if we don't come to agreement we could lose our aaa credit rating. not because we don't have the capacity to pay our bills we do,
but because we didn't have a aaa political system to match our aaa credit rating. >> david, simon is of the opinion that it falls squarely on speaker john boehner in a political context. i'm in the sure that's how the american people will see this. your response? >> i think the mighty simon hobbs has it right, and i think the key point he was driving at there is that republicans have politicized the debt ceiling fight. which was never politicized in the past. we've heard in the last few weeks again and again and again democrats, republicans, under a democratic president and then republican president, a one-page bill. lawrence has been waving it around on his show day and day again this was a routine matter. what republicans have done now, not just shown we're going to make it into a political circus today we're prepared to do it six months from now, do it eight months from now. every time it has to go up again. so everything that simon just
described is going to be the new reality thanks to the republicans. and who gets most of the blame for that is indeed john boehner, because he's letting the tea party tail wag the dog. >> it's not just the issue of for how long we're going to raise the debt ceiling, because my understanding is that the boehner plan buys a six months and harry reid's plan puts it off beyond a year. men, here's what concerns me the most. what they have in common is they both punt insofar as they don't address any tax issues or entitlements but rather subject that to a committee review. well, what prospect is there if we can't agree right now that this committee several months in the future is going to agree and simon, your bailiwick, not mine. seems to me that that portends instability we can ill afford. >> yes. you can have the instat. don't play with the people that have lost $14 trillion to the united states. that's the issue. it's been overloaded the
mechanism with something they should not overload it with. this should have been sorted out in a different way at a different time. as a result putting those people that lengths money to the united states in good conscience and faith and actually putting them on the line. that's what they're risking. they're risking the reputation of the united states in international financial circles. it will be a huge milestone. >> do you see -- simon, do you see indications of money having been moved out of the united states? >> no, because at the end of the day, it is the treasury's, the great safe haven. everybody else may have to bend the rules in order that people stay in treasury. that is not the point. this is about the credibility of the united states internationally, and at a time when today we discovered that the figures we had in the first quarter were wrong. the economy only grew 1.3% in the second quarter. this economy is in a really, really bad state, and arguably, we should be attempting to stimulate our way out of this.
nobody is stepping up to the plate as a point when unemployment continues to rise to 9.2%. >> i want to show you congressman barney frank during the debate just this afternoon. take a watch and respond to this. >> i remember speaker o'neil when i got here. there's one thing he and speaker boehner seem to have in common. that's a theme song. speaker o'neil's theme song was i will be with you in apple blossom time. speaker boehner is allowed to have the song, it's my party and i'll cry if i wanted you. >> gerald connolly of virginia during the debate as well. >> this bill is greatant cynical exercise in raw political muscle and nothing more. to the house republicans bent on turning our founding fathers into deadbeat dads, i would respond using speaker boehner's own words from last year. hell, no, you can't. >> david, any winners in this process? the president re-emerged earlier
today. took some of the spotlight back. it's hard for me to identify those coming out of this politically gaining? >> well, it's not john boehner's party. he has not been able to do what he wanted. he was not in a position to negotiate a grand bargain, whether it was good, bad or indifferent. he's allowed notion of deficit reduction to be attached to the deficit issue, which as simon pointed out is really the core of the problem here, and right now the president has been trying to look reasonable. here's the guy comes out and says listen i want a compromise. there's no question he has bent more, he has offered more, even going against some democratic articles of faith, putting social security, medicare on the table. i don't even like what i hear coming ow out of the white house in some ways but i recognize he's been trying to get a deal. what's happened we've seen in the last 24 hours is that republicans and the house as we get closer to d-day, to the midnight hour, they are moving away from the middle position. they are making things more
difficult to pass, and as chuck described early on at the top of the show, they are fooling with this legislative calendar in which there are only a couple of hours left to get things rolling. so everyone's looking bad, and this is part of the problem. you have basically the republicans created a targeted and drew everybody into it and the president is having trouble soaring above that. he's doing the best we can. at the end of the day, if he can't make these people act reasonably, he will share in the blame. this is washington's dysfunction. it's washington's dysfunction caused by a small band of people, where the real responsibility lies. >> men, i've got to leave you both. here's the sound bite that i imagine they're most concerned at at the white house, regard luz how much the president compromised, the reduction of a aaa rating on his watch. simon ten seconds to respond. >> it's unfortunate. you've got it look at the tea party people.
understand what they came in on, the mandate. it's justified. the rest of the political establishment should have reached out to the tea party, found a way to look in, the spending cuts, so they could guarantee -- should have been more bringing the tea party into the fold. >> simon -- i'm sorry. >> it presupposes there was room for compromise on their part which i don't think exists. >> that's a political process we should have. for more inclusive including everybody. >> thank you both. david, unfortunately i'm out of time. thank you, david corn. how far will the tea party take this default? i'll ask a tea party member how far he plans to go next. you're watching "hardball" only on msnbc.
president obama has take ton twitter to pressure republicans on a compromise 209 debt deal. all day long the obama supporters two tweet republican members of congress. it started around noon eastern way plefrg from the president himself. time for putting party first is is over. if you want to see a bipartisan compromise, let congress know. call, e-mail, tweet. the tweets kept coming. state by state urging followers to tweet their republican members of congress. this is what political arm twisting looks like in a digital world. we'll be right back. with the full flavor of kraft mayo with olive oil. ♪ made with half the fat and calories of hellmann's real mayo... ...kraft mayo with olive oil is the new standard in mayo.
one burden we can lift ourselves. we can end it with a simple vote. welcome back to "hardball." that was the president earlier this morning appealing to republicans in the house to take action, and move quickly to raise the debt ceiling before tuesday's deadline. but will they? joining us now republican congressman steve cain of iowa. thanks for being here. how will you vote on speaker boehner's proposal? >> in a few minutes i'll go vote no on that proposal. >> how come? >> because it doesn't take us far enough. it only cuts next year's appropriations by $7 billion, and the ryan budget is as 3 $s billion. we give up on the ryan budget if we do that. it's a second tranche, down the road into february. kicks the can down the road. doesn't hold together our definition of a balanced budget. just says a balanced budget amendment. we need to do more. the best this proposal can do, low are the trajectory of the national debt's increase so that
ten years from now we won't have a $25 trillion debt. onlies 24y have $24 trillion. that's not good enough and bad for our markets in the long run. >> do you believe this is all hyped? not accepting the fact tuesday the government runs out of money? >> we don't run out of money or tuesday. this has been overhyped and i will say we won't be in a position where this debt creel lag to be increased. it's the conditions over which and when we need to raise the debt creeling that this discussion is about. the default language used is overhyped. a default has now been defined to mean anytime that the united states runs out of a borrowing authority rather than we might not be servicing our debt. we pay our interest and principle on the day it's due. that will happen and the president should guarantee that. >> congressman, how about this concern. express by the president earlier today. i thought he made an important point about the country's credit rating. let's listen.
>> and make no mistake, for those who say they oppose tax increases on anyone, a lower credit rating would result potentially in a tax increase on everyone in the form of higher interest rates on their mortgages, their car loans, their credit cards, and that's inexcusable. >> what has driven us to this stand standstill, doesn't the president make a valid point when he says if we lose the aaa bond rating essentially taxes are going up on all of us? >> he also said in the previous clip we can solve this way simple vote. this is far more complicated. this is about 75 years of accumulated overspending. it's about the acceleration in the overspending of this administration. a lot of it driven by the pelosi congress in the last few years. we came with $160 billion of balancing the budget during the height of the iraq war. now the president offering a $1.6 trillion deficit for a
single budget. ten times what it was a few years ago and all we have to do borrow the mchb money and it will solve the money. that does not solve it. it delays the crisis. i want to dial down the trajectory of our deficit and be able to predict a balanced budget at some point. the president apparently doesn't want a balanced budget or he would have accepted $1.4 trillion when we offered it to him with cut, cap and balance. >> next friday if we experience a drop in credit rating and interest rates go up from automobiles to home mortgages, will you have been wrong? >> it's way too soon to say. it's going to take months to look back on this and some has to do with how this is messaged. the president is messaging this to damage the markets, and i don't think there's been enough message out here on the top of -- on all of our leadership to say default is not what you say it is. we're not going to default. we could, and should, and the president should at this point define what his priorities are. if he doesn't get his debt ceiling increase he should be
telling the american markets where he's going to prioritize to put that money. i say pay the troops first, service the debt second. if the president has national security issues, put those in third. then take care of our seniors, 10er9 social security and medicare and there's smil money left over. there's is not a crisis that starts at midnight on august 2eneden. >> thank you, congressman king. joining me now, house whip steny hoyer. strong difference of opinion i guess among those on the hill, congressman. maybe not as bad as we've been led to believe, or so i was just told. >> there is a strong disagreement and congressman king does not review the views of his leadership on either the senate side or the house side where they all believe that not meeting our obligations on tuesday will have great adverse ramifications for every american family, and it will be immediate. the american families have already lost as a result of the,
what i would say game playing, the politicization of this issue, have already lost $400 billion in net worth since mr. boehner walked out of the hearing, out of the agreement with president obama. and would not pursue those obviously because he couldn't get his party to the agree, which we have seen over the last full 36 hours. >> congressman, i just saw speaker boehner walk behind you, perhaps going to initiate this voted. where are we headed? tell the american people whants about to unfold in the next 42, 78 hours? >> hopefully we're going to get real. the vote to which we are now going is not a real vote and they know it. what's happened is, mr. king says, no, they didn't move far enough towards the far right for him, but they did move towards the right. they made no efforts for compromise. no effort to bring the congress together and get a solution which would ensure that this gun
to america's credit's head does not go off. that america's trustworthiness, credit worthiness and respect around the world would remain intact. the rest of the world and every american, i'm sure, is outraged and angered by the fact that the congress is not addressing this in an adult way, as the speaker suggested we ought to. >> thank you, congressman steny hoyer. up next, texas governor rick perry flip-flops on same-sex marriage. lasthe said he supports it. that's ahead in the "sideshow." you've watching "hardball," only on msnbc.
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voicing support for new york's right to pass a law allowing gay marriage. let's listen. >> that's new york, and that's their business, and that's fine with me. that is their call. if you believe in the tenth amendment, stay out of their business, if you live in some other state or particularly in you're the federal government. >> no surprise that didn't sit well with perry's supporters. so how about a clarification? >> it's a small group of activists judges, and frankly, a small handful, if you will, of states and these liberal special interest groups that are intent on a redefinition, if you will, of marriage on the nation, for all of us. to not pass the federal marriage amendment would impinge on texas, and other states, right, not to the have marriage forced pop them by these activist judges and these special interest groups. >> sounds like more of a 1 0 80
me. unless, of course, texas doesn't approve. next, i spoke with the idea presented by some of his former colleagues that the urgency of raising the debt ceiling is majorly overblown. listen to this. >> the final question, if i might for senator simpson. what's the response to those out there aing, michele bachmann included, we don't want to raise the debt ceiling and that frankly this is a whole chicken little thing created. it's really not going to be as bad as they say it's going to be? >> it will be a different definition of chicken but the last word won't be little. >> no, it's pretty clear what he was getting at. next up, looks like president obama has dual reasons for speaking about fuel-efficient vehicles in washington this morning. he's already thinking ahead to his daughter getting behinded wheel. let's listen.
>> as some of you may know it's only a matter of time until malia gets her learner's permit. so i'm hoping to see one of those models that gets a top speed of 15 miles an hour. the ejector seat any time boys are in the car. so hopefully you guys have some of those in the pipeline. >> motivation for all the dads out there to get behind this cause. up next, is anybody winning this fight republicans and democrats are hitting the airwaves hard. the ads from each side and see who's winning the message war. you're watching "hardball" only on msnbc.
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wrap. another batch of updeceit earnings not enough to offset dismal economic numbers and lingering fears about the debt debac debacle. the dow jones industrial tumbling. and absolutely dangerous, how one investor described the atmosphere on wall street today telling cnbc the problem is the market reacts to two thing. greed and fear. right now there's no greed in the air, only fear. a lot of that fear based on the ongoing debate in washington over raising the debt ceiling and cutting the deficit. aps an anemic reading on gdp growth, weaker than expected 1.3% while first quarter numbers were prevised to lower to a paltry 0.4%. over a rough week for the market. all major indices giving up between 3.5 and 4.5%. that's it from cnbc, first in business worldwide. now back to "hardball."
welcome back to "hardball." watching the battle on capitol hill these past few weeks. outside interest groups have also been eaker to throw stones at their opponents in this debt fight. millions of dollars spent on ad buys attacking the president, but if the country defaults and the economy suffers, don't the president's re-election chances suffer as well? nbc political analyst and an associate editor and columnist at "the washington post" as well as an msnbc analyst. gentlemen, i want to show you previews of coming attractions. actually, house speaker john boehner is set to speak from capitol hill. so stay right where you are's we're going to take the speaker's remarks. -- rather quickly. today's report on the economy reminds us that our economy is still not creating enough jobs. americans are worried about
finding work. they're worried about our economy, and they're worried about the mountain of debt that's facing them and their children. today we have a chance to end this debt limit crisis. with this bill i think we're keeping our promise to the american people that we will cut spending by more than the increase in the debt limit. the congressional budget office has certified this common sense standard and it's been backed by more than 150 distinguished economists from across the country. we're also imposing caps to refrain future spending giving our economy a chance to grow and create jobs, and we're advancing the great cause of a balanced budget amendment to the constitution. [ applause ] what this bill now says is that before the president can request an additional increase in the
debt limit, two things have to happen. a joint committee of the congress must produce a spending cuts larger than the increase in the debt limit and both houses of the congress must send to the states a balanced budget amendment. listen, a balanced budget amendment is, it is -- it's time for this to happen. it enjoys support in both houses of this congress and it enjoys bipartisan and widespread support across our country. the bill also ends this crisis without raising taxes, which would cripple our economy, and there's no gimmicks. there's no smoke screens here. representing the old ways of doing things. now, the bill before us still isn't perfect. no member would argue that it is. it's imperfect, because it reflects and honest and sin serious effort to end this crisis by sending the bill over
to the senate that one time as agreed to by the bipartisan leadership of the united states senate. and to my colleagues in the senate if they were here i would say this -- if this bill passes, this house has sent you not one but two different bills to cut spending by trillions of dollars over the next decade while providing an immediate increase in the debt ceiling. and to the american people i would say, we've tried our level best. we've done everything we can to find a common sense solution that would pass both houses of congress and end this crisis. we tried to do the right thing by our country, but some people continue to say, no. my colleagues, i have worked since the first week of this session when we were sworn in in january to avoid being where we are right this moment. two days after we were sworn in, the treasury secretary sent us a
letter asking us to increase the debt ceiling. i immediately responded by saying, we would not increase the debt ceiling without serious cuts in spending and serious reforms to the way we spend the people's money. [ applause ] we passed a budget. the other body spent over 800 days, and still no budget. no plan. this will be the second bill we've sent over to the senate, and yet not one piece of legislation out of the senate has passed that deals with this crisis. my colleagues, i can tell you that i have worked with the president and the administration since the beginning of this year to avoid being in this spot. i have offered ideas. i have negotiated. not one time, not one time did the administration ever put any
plan on the table. all they would do was criticize what i put out there. i stuck my neck out a mile to try to get an agreement with the president of the united states. i stuck my neck out a mile and i put revenues on the table. in order to try to come to an agreement to avert us being where we are. well, a lot of people in this town can never say yes. a lot of people can never say yes. this house has acted. and it is time for the administration and time for our colleagues across the aisle to put something on the table. tell us where you are. [ applause ] thank you.
and, yes, people can be critical of what we've done, but where are the other ideas? at this point in time, the house is going to act to bring an act again. but it is time for our colleagues across the aisle to tell us what they're for. tell us how we can end this crisis. you know, ronald reagan, it's been quoted over the last few weeks, and ronald reagan would probably be flattered, i'm sure, if he were here. but ronald reagan on his desk had a little placard and that little placard was real simple. it says -- it said, it can be done. i have a replica of that placard on my desk, and let me tell you, members of this house it can be done. it must be done and it will be done if we have the courage to do the right thing. so for the sake of our economy, for the sake of our future, i'm
going to ask each of you as representatives of the people of the united states to support this bill, to support this process, and end this crisis now. that was house speaker john boehner. let me go back to my guest, richard wolff and eugene robinson. richard, i'm living and taking notes. when there was blow back from the house chamber, it seemed extemporaneously, the speaker said i put revenues on the table. there are no revenues in that which is about to get passed by the house. i wonder if he's going to regret having offered that to his colleagues? >> we have multiple personalities than john boehner. talks about jobs, knows he's not actually talking about jobs. that was his opening. secondly, he knows he'll have to take a very different bill to the same house in a matter of days, which will be what comes out of the senate.
eamer that or he'll be in real trouble with whatever he thinks it the american people want to hear is completely overtaken by talks of a shutdown, social security checks not paid. and thirdly, where was the john boehner offering revenues and how come now we're talking about a balanced budget amendment? there are multiple characters and maultiple politics played ot right there in that speech. >> gene, his future was very much on the line, or is very much on the line as the house speaker, tos extend he can't get anything out. he can't personally survive in that role. >> absolutely. look, last night he couldn't get a bill through. he had to add this balanced budget amendment provision, which is, you know, if there weren't already enough poison pills in the bill to make it a non-starter in the senate, that certainly doesn't. so, no. that's not going to happen. i've heard him trying to do two things there. number one. keep the base in line, because after all, they haven't voted
yet. and so he's still trying to appeal to those recalcitrant tea party voters whose votes he needs in a few minutes and at the same time, i stuck my neck out a mile. there's obviously perception that president obama has done better at this sort of reasonable man, public relations part of this negotiation. he has seemed more reasonable. willing to compromise. and so i think boehner was trying to say, to a larger audience, look, you know, i tried to compromise, too. >> richard, what of the criticism that the administration has never put anything on the table? i continually hear this from radio callers who will say the administration put nothing in writing? >> you know, i find it a very weird rallying cry. in a was obviously the moment when everyone vented throughout in the house chamber and they all cheered, but, really, is that the biggest blow you can
land then you've lost the debate. because it's a processing criticism. it's all ak tactics, not the actual message or younder lying problems or whatever you're trying to say to the merch people. it's just that we don't like the wear you're doing business. that seems to me incoherent rage at this president, and frustration at the way this has played out. we've heard multiple time what's the president thinks about various pieces of this debate. they want everything in trip blick kit or his numbers to shoot down. that's not the way it works. >> a week ago at this hour, walked out ex-tempter rainously. i was on the air. men, stay right where you prp we've all got more we want to say about this. richard wolff and eugene robinson are staying with us. follow me on twigger, just figure out thousand spell smerconish. [ coughing continues ]
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warning to house republicans thinking about voting for speaker boehner's debt plan which she opposes. on her facebook page sheers of their principles and wrote all my best to you gop freshmen from up here from the last frontier, sincerely, sarah palin. p.s., everyone i talk to still believes in contested primaries. we know where she stands.
budget also drew a round of applause from the house chamber but that is probably one of the things that makes this dead on arrival went whe it gets to the senate. >> this is a zombie on arrival. we don't have the time for this kind of posturing but they are going about it anyway. i find it curious that after manufacturing this crisis what we have now is house republicans talking about themselves. john boehner speaks almost entirely about himself here. it is very inward looking about the principles they care about, not about what can get out of congress. it is about how john boehner stuck his neck out and how he is sticking it back in. it is not about them any more. it is the about the economy, about the world economy. time to stop thinking about your own politics getting through congress. >> your budget intuitively makes sense to me. don't we balance our budgets at home but i say, wait, i balance my budget at home butcy a
mortgage and car loan. isn't that proper analogy to be using? >> it sounds great if you think after country budget like a household budget. but nations are not like households. they aren't. they are sovereign, number one, number two, they print money. they -- and control the money supply in ways that are -- that should be the simulator calm down the economy. it is called economics. it is simply not a good analogy to say, if we have to balance our budget at home every month, the country should have to could do that and be locked in by a balanced budget and amendment. it is true there are dangerous levels of accumulative debt for nations to run and we are getting there. we feed to get a handle on the stat and deficits we have been running. can't be run indefinitely. but you can't make that comparison. it just doesn't work. wrirktsds a. >> it would seen sooem that
regardless of what comes out of the house and to the president's desk, to simpson bowls and i come back to the point and say if simpson bowles couldn't get through how does this climate get through, richard? >> maybe that's the silver lining. remember it was a republican idea which republicans voted against, democrats voted against it too. the president had to put it into action himself and they he backed off it. maybe the politics of all this will change. on the other hand, it is an election year and maybe nothing the change. >> what do you see in the next 48 hours, u general? >> oh, thanks. in the next 48 hours. well, in the next four or five hours, i see assuming that boehner gets the bill through right now, i see harry reid figuring out what mechanism he will use to get a bill ready for tonight, so he can get the ball
rolling tomorrow, and maybe they can make a tuesday deadline. if you think that u.s. senate can move that fast. even in your dreams. >> we need those who intervene in the nfl situation. i think to come to washington and square this away. >> we need captain america, is what we need. >> thank you, both. thank you richard wolffe. thank you eugene, robinson. when we return, allow me to fin wish the debt solution right before congress's eyes. you're watching "hardball" only on msnbc. access in an instant access in an instant every patient's past. and because the whole hospital's working together, there's a family who can breathe easy, right now. somewhere in america, we've already answered some of the nation's toughest healthcare questions. and the over 60,000 people of siemens are ready to do it again. siemens. answers.
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let me fin finish tonight with a word of caution. few things are certain in the fiscal debate but there seems to be one agreement. the plan they settle on will call for a congressional panel to do heavy lifting by future government savings. however nor boehner nor reid can guarantee there will be an agreement within that committee much less congressional approval of its recommendations. and no plan under consideration right now seems to provide guidance regarding savings that might be found in medicare, medicaid or social security which together account for more than 40% of federal spending. does it sound familiar? it should because we've already been down the committee root with simpson bowles and their commission. the committee did its works. congress didn't follow through. the form ear name was the national committee on fis ral responsibility and reform. the house and senate all had a hand in selecting it.
simpson and bowles chaired it. they comprised. they produced a blueprint that makes members of congress wince. touching political third rails. this was shared sacrifice. nothing and no one was off limits. not entitlements, not the military, not the wealthy. as allen simpson told me yesterday, unless you punch a hole in every sacred cow, they'll just wander the fields forever. so the report garnered 11 of 18 votes of support, short of the 14 necessary to trigger congressional action. if simpson bowles couldn't get committee approval what makes us think boehner-reid will? here is my idea wp while congress stands around waiting for leaders to negotiate deals, most of which are dead on arrival, why doesn't someone ring the bell in washington and have the vote we never have. at least then the american people would know who was really ready to see the